Topic: WWW #293 - Earl Howe / ERA / Roosevelt Field / Vanderbilt Cup / Oct 12, 1936

[Otto Puzzell]

For one point: Identify the car, the driver, and the venue

Only a complete and specific answer will earn a point!  

If you haven't registered yet, you need to do so in order to reply.  You can do so by clicking here.

If you have not done so, please familiarize yourself with the AutoPuzzles Rules before attempting to solve this puzzle.

[richard fridd]

Earl Howe ERA R.8.B.C at Roosevelt Field USA Vanderbilt cup race october 12th 1936

[Otto Puzzell]

That was quick

[richard fridd]

But is it correct? ERA badge on the car/Howe written on the wall and number  15 ties up with the venue on the net and the chssis number and  date is confirmed in the David Weguelin ERA book which was well worth getting out for a browse I might add.

[Otto Puzzell]

"Earl Howe isn't his actual name, but it's a whole lot quicker to say than 5th Earl Howe, Edward Richard Francis Assheton, Viscount Curzon. A member of the British parliament, Howe didn't take up racing until the age of 44, but he took to it quickly. Just three years after his debut he won the 1931 24 Hours of Le Mans aboard an Alfa Romeo. He won several other sports car races in the 1930s as well. His lone Indy Car appearance came at the Vanderbilt Cup in 1936. He started all the way back in 41st, but drove through the field to a 13th place finish. Here he is in his ERA-B preparing to take to the track a Roosevelt Raceway - New York (USA), 12 OCTOBER 1936"

[Allan L]

A pedant he say:
Richard's original answer "R8 B C" is the shorthand way of referring to a car that was upgraded from R8B to R8C during its life. It was never both (that's impossible) and what we see here is R8B
Francis Richard Henry Penn Curzon, 5th Earl Howe (1884–1964) is the man they mean in that text Otto quotes.
Edward Richard Assheton Curzon, 6th Earl Howe (1908–1984) was his son and had he taken up motor racing at the age of 44 (in 1952) the rest wouldn't make sense.
Both were MPs until they succeded to the Earldom, sitting as Conservatives under the courtesy title of Viscount Curson (which name Francis raced under until he succeeded in 1929) and whilst the House of Lords is part of the British Parliament we don't refer to its occupants as Members of Parliament.

[RayTheRat]

A pedant he say:
Richard's original answer "R8 B C" is the shorthand way of referring to a car that was upgraded from R8B to R8C during its life. It was never both (that's impossible) and what we see here is R8B
Francis Richard Henry Penn Curzon, 5th Earl Howe (1884–1964) is the man they mean in that text Otto quotes.
Edward Richard Assheton Curzon, 6th Earl Howe (1908–1984) was his son and had he taken up motor racing at the age of 44 (in 1952) the rest wouldn't make sense.
Both were MPs until they succeeded to the Earldom, sitting as Conservatives under the courtesy title of Viscount Curson (which name Francis raced under until he succeeded in 1929) and whilst the House of Lords is part of the British Parliament we don't refer to its occupants as Members of Parliament.

Pursuing the pedantry, I don't quite understand this.  I plead ignorance of the British parliamentary/Peerage system, other than a few bits and pieces I've read here and there.  Anyhow, does the bold and italicized sentence state that both gentlemen were initially elected Members of Parliament, then received a peerage for one reason or other?  

The other question is "what's the equivalent name (MP) for members of the House of Lords?"

Thanks for any enlightenment,

RtR

[Carnut]

An Earl (Lord) cannot be a Member of Parliament, since they sit in the House of Lords as opposed to the MPs, who sit in the House of Commons.  It was a hereditary title which passed on death, so each of those Earls could be MPs until their fathers died and they succeeded to the title, when they would have the option either of relinquishing their title so they could remain an MP (there are instances of that, even relatively recently when Lord Home relinquished his so he could be the Prime Minister Alec Douglas-Home) or else resigning their seat in the Commons and taking up their seat in the House of Lords.
There is no designation for those who sit in the House of Lords equivalent to "MP" as they already have a title which entitles them to be members of the Upper House (as it is also known); they can be Lords or Bishops.  Originally all Lords succeeded to the title, but latterly peers have been created by the Prime Minister to balance the House, as since it was originally all aristocrats it was inherently Conservative.  Now many "Life Peers" are created by PMs giving titles to their cronies so that the hereditary peers don't have it all their own way; the peerage does not pass to the next generation but dies with the holder.  There are moves afoot to change the whole system so that peers are elected to the Upper House, but it seems to have fallen through for the moment as we have a mainly Conservative government sitting and they have no stomach to change a system which actually benefits them more than the others...!
Hope all clear!

[Allan L]

The earldom is hereditory so on the death of the current Earl he was succeeded by the next in line, usually his eldest son (if he were still alive!). Francis Howe was the 5th Earl and his son the 6th. We have the 7th Earl in the House of Lords now, as it happens.
The convention was that until one became a Peer (the generic term for all ranks of titles that entitled the holder to a seat in the House of Lords) one was a commoner, and therefore those with political ambitions could offer themselves for election as members of the House of Commons. Whilst the Commons is technically the lower house, in recent times (20th century on) the govenment of the country is conducted there, with the House of Lords having a secondary role.
Some of the families have several titles, acquired in historical times and in the 1920/30 period the Earl Howe also held a Viscountcy in his family name of Curzon (not Curson as I wrote before) and although the sons of peers are common enough to be Members of Parliament, it was conventional for them to use one of the family's lesser titles as what was called a "courtesy title". Hence the man with the ERA was known as Viscount Curzon both on the race track and in the House of Commons until his father died when he became Earl Howe which disqualified him from membership of the House of Commons.
By now, unlike in Francis Howe's time, only a small proportion of the hereditory peers have seats in the House of Lords: in 1963 a system of "Life Peers" came into being so that people could be rewarded for their achievements with a seat in the House of Lords without their family benefitting for ever after (as before).
Hope this helps - it's an engineer writing it, not a professor of politics!
Mind works slowly at this time of night and Carnut beat me to it, but I'll let what I wrote stand!

[RayTheRat]

Thanks to both of you.  It clarified things a bit....and I appreciate the clarification.

RtR
(Rattus Deserticus)...common desert rat.