Topic: Neverending Chain, now closed!

[Otto Puzzell]

Lotus 7 and Sunbeam Tiger

Both were vehicles featured in the opening credits of 1960's TV programs about secret agents.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/Sv813f2Xtrg&amp;amp;hl=en_US&amp;amp;fs=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/Sv813f2Xtrg&amp;amp;hl=en_US&amp;amp;fs=1</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/AvMj5LuT5hk&amp;amp;hl=en_US&amp;amp;fs=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/AvMj5LuT5hk&amp;amp;hl=en_US&amp;amp;fs=1</a>

[metalshapes]

Sunbeam Tiger and '63  AC Cobra.

Both British built roadsters powered by Small Block Fords, that got a got a hardtop to clean up the aerodynamics for LeMans.

[Otto Puzzell]

AC Cobra and Jaguar E-Type

Both employed a Salisbury 4HU unit with inboard disk brakes, to reduce unsprung weight.

[barrett]

Jaguar E-type and Mercedes-Benz 190SL
Both cars featured on Donald Byrd albums for Blue Note

[Amsterdam]

 Mercedes-Benz 190SL and the 1975 Monica

Both makes are named after a womans firstname who both where not directly involved in the production of these makes, but where only related to those who where

 Mercedes named after Mercedes Jellinek, daughter of Emil Jellinek, the Austro-Hungarian consul in Nice, France, at the turn of the century.  He stared to race cars under the name of his daughter and raced a with a  Daimler Phoenix
He ordered 36 new Daimler race cars in 1900, who where to be designed to his wiches, with the demand they would be named Mercedes
The rest is history

 Monica was a brand of luxury cars created in France in the 1970s by Jean Tastevin, a French industrialist whose wife's name was Monica

[metalshapes]

Monica and 1964 Farcel Vega II

They are the last, and second to last attempts to create a luxury brand in France.

And they were both powered by American Crysler V8 engines.

[Carnut]

Thought the Monica had a home-grown V8 engine designed by Chris Lawrence?

[Paul Jaray]

Monica cars had also Triumph and Aston Martin engines.

[Allan L]

We had the "named after  a lady connected with the dealer" some 19 months ago:

Mercedes 79\200 PS                     and      what car?                                                                       why?

1955 Swallow Doretti based on Triumph mechanical components.
The Mercedes "brand" was named after Mercedes Jellinek, daughter of Daimler's French distributor
The Doretti name came from the Italianisation of Arthur Andersen’s daughter Dorothy Dean’s name who was also Triumph’s distributor for Southern California and by all accounts was a stunning blond.
i.e. both named after young ladies, both of whom were daughters of the cars distributors.

[metalshapes]

Thought the Monica had a home-grown V8 engine designed by Chris Lawrence?

Found online.

"The earliest prototype Monicas were powered by a Ted Martin designed 3.4l V8 engine but later prototypes and the production model were equipped with a Chrysler 5.6 l (340 in³) V8 engine."

So that would make the 1975 car pictured Chrysler powered...


So what is the propper etiquette for this?

Its not that I havent seen entries to this Thread that I wondered about ( or even suspected to be wrong...)

But I thought it to be better, and more sportsman like, to let P J be the referee.



So are all links still good, or is the chain broken?

[metalshapes]

And please define " home grown" on a French car built  in France, while the design development and prototype building of it was done in England...

[Paul Jaray]

Thank you for your help, Allan.
We had:
both cars are named after a lady who had a relative who was important in the creation of the vehicle (Lotus Elise and Austro-Daimler Maja)   
and
both cars are named after daughters of the cars distributors     (Mercedes 79\200 PS 1915 and Swallow Doretti 1955) 
Amsterdam proposal was:
both makes are named after women not directly involved in the production of these makes, but where only related to those who where

The 2nd is out (Monica was a wife and not a daughter)
The 1st was about the Model (Lotus Elise and Austro-Daimler Maja) rather than the Maker (Mercedes and Monica)

This make it a valid one.

[Paul Jaray]

Thought the Monica had a home-grown V8 engine designed by Chris Lawrence?

Found online.

"The earliest prototype Monicas were powered by a Ted Martin designed 3.4l V8 engine but later prototypes and the production model were equipped with a Chrysler 5.6 l (340 in³) V8 engine."

So that would make the 1975 car pictured Chrysler powered...


So what is the propper etiquette for this?

Its not that I havent seen entries to this Thread that I wondered about ( or even suspected to be wrong...)

But I thought it to be better, and more sportsman like, to let P J be the referee.



So are all links still good, or is the chain broken?

Monica cars had Chrysler engines too and they were considered as french as they could be.
I will accept this too.

[Allan L]

Thank you for your help, Allan.
We had:
both cars are named after a lady who had a relative who was important in the creation of the vehicle (Mercedes 79\200 PS 1915 and Swallow Doretti 1955)
and
both cars are named after daughters of the cars distributors (Lotus Elise and Austro-Daimler Maja)       
Amsterdam proposal was:
both makes are named after women not directly involved in the production of these makes, but where only related to those who where

The 2nd is out (Monica was a wife and not a daughter)
The 1st was about the Model (Lotus Elise and Austro-Daimler Maja) rather than the Maker (Mercedes and Monica)

This make it a valid one.

Actually your second definition there is true for Mercedes (Emil Jellinek was the French agent for Daimler) and Doretti (Italianised version of Dorothy, daughter of Arthur Andersen who was Triumph distributor in Southern California) - as I wrote when I first posted it 19 months ago.

[Carnut]

And please define " home grown" on a French car built  in France, while the design development and prototype building of it was done in England...

I was out of the country at the time so couldn't check my facts.  Couldn't remember if it was a Lawrence or Martin-designed engine (knew it was one or the other) so I plumped for Lawrence...

Home-grown because the development was (as you say) done in England, and Martin was a Brit; I always think of the car as Anglo-French.  It was very optimistic to fit an engine of their own design and think that's largely why the project failed.  So much money was spent designing it and trying to make it work that there wasn't enough left to develop the car properly once they decided to make do with an American engine.

I wasn't trying to spoil the connection; just making an observation.  Decisions are PJ's to make.

[metalshapes]

I wasn't trying to spoil the connection; just making an observation.  Decisions are PJ's to make.

I didn't think you were,

Sorry if it came across that way.


I'm guessing this is the Martin engine that was a V8 which was partly based on the Kent?

Interesting engine, I saw one in parts in a box when I was buying used racecar parts for my Mallock in Dover.

One of its interesting features was that that the big ends forked around eachother so the banks ( and cylinder heads ) did not have to be offset.
Which made the engine shorter.

There was a Super Saloon Escort running with one...

[Paul Jaray]

Thank you for your help, Allan.
We had:
both cars are named after a lady who had a relative who was important in the creation of the vehicle (Mercedes 79\200 PS 1915 and Swallow Doretti 1955)
and
both cars are named after daughters of the cars distributors (Lotus Elise and Austro-Daimler Maja)       
Amsterdam proposal was:
both makes are named after women not directly involved in the production of these makes, but where only related to those who where

The 2nd is out (Monica was a wife and not a daughter)
The 1st was about the Model (Lotus Elise and Austro-Daimler Maja) rather than the Maker (Mercedes and Monica)

This make it a valid one.

Actually your second definition there is true for Mercedes (Emil Jellinek was the French agent for Daimler) and Doretti (Italianised version of Dorothy, daughter of Arthur Andersen who was Triumph distributor in Southern California) - as I wrote when I first posted it 19 months ago.

I obviously wrote it wrong...I meant the opposite and I'll fix it.
We can proceed from:

Monica and 1964 Farcel Vega II

They are the last, and second to last attempts to create a luxury brand in France, both powered by American Crysler V8 engines.

[Paul Jaray]

Is it over?

[75america]

Is it over?

Don't think so because it is a NEVERENDING chain  :

Facel Vega II and Bertone Freeclimber.

Both companies made bodies for other brands before they made cars under their own brand name.

[metalshapes]

Is it over?

Don't think so because it is a NEVERENDING chain  :

Thanks for saving it 75America.

It would have been sad if my rudeness towards Carnut would have killed it.

Sorry for that...

[Djetset]

The Bertone Freeclimber and the De Tomaso UAZ Simbir.

Both were Italian-assembled versions of existing overseas 4x4 SUVs. (Daihatsu Rugger/Rocky/Fourtrack and UAZ 3160)

I hope this helps to strengthen the Chain.  (attached photo show's De Tomaso Bereti on the left signing the production agreement with UAZ's senior management).

[Paul Jaray]

Are we close to the end?

[Otto Puzzell]

De Tomaso UAZ Simbir and Ford/Lincoln/Mercury Pantera

Both are vehicles built by De Tomaso AND also sold and marketed by other companies than De Tomaso AND named per different-language variations of the word 'Panther', AND constructed with engines from third-party companies.

[Paul Jaray]

And the winner is......

[del78]

what about that one:

deTomaso Pantera & Lamborghini Miura
2 italian supercars wchich  successor was only a factory mock up concept without continuation