Topic: Whaddyacallit #167 - Lohner Porsche

[Ray B.]

Ever seen this ?

If you did, please respond below and let us know the make and model designation of the car posted here.
If you haven't registered yet, you need to do so in order to reply with your answer.
Also, please be sure to check out our other puzzles, and, please post a puzzle of your own if you'd like - the more, the merrier.
Thanks!

[Allan L]

That's a Lohner-Posche electric racing car(!) developed for Mr E.W. Hart of Luton. It had four hub-mounted motors and the weight of the batteries alone was said to be 4000 lb.

[Ray B.]

Partially correct answer, in need of improvement.

[Allan L]

Partially correct answer, in need of improvement.

Well that's the caption for the photo in Richard v. Frankenberg's biography of Dr. Ferdinand Porsche. Perhaps I should have added that it dates from 1900.
Later Lohner-Porsche vehicles were petrol-electric ("mixte") which avoided that battery weight, and most of those were only front-wheel drive.

[Ray B.]

Allan, the point is yours anyhow, but I keep thinking that your identification is wrong. This is a Lohner-Porsche alright, but I don't think this is the Hart car (also called the "Toujours contente"). I tried to doublecheck the internet sources (never too trustworthy) and according to them the Hart car could be one of those (most probably the red car).
As for the puzzle car, obviously not a race or record car, all my sources agree that it is an hybrid, four wheel drive, dated 1900 or 1901.

[Allan L]

Despite what some internet sources say, I am pretty sure that the puzzle car is not "mixte" - v. Frankenberg may well be wrong too, but I don't think so. What is clear to me is that there is no sign that it is other than an electric car.
In "The Lost Causes of Motoring" (Europe Vol 1) Lord Montagu, writing from Michael Sedgwick's research, says:" That early British entrepreneur, E.W. Hart, tried to introduce the system to our islands, and ran a four-wheel drive model in the ACGBI's Electric Car Trials in November 1900. Alas, Hart had a genius for backing the wrong horses, and the car he had christened La Toujours Contente turned out to be just that, achieving nothing."

To labour the point, a "mixte" would not have qualified for those trials, and I think they did not appear until 1902 anyway.

[Ray B.]

I usually trust more historians than the internet, even if my identification is given on "serious" websites such as the PSA website, because often people just copy and paste information taken elsewhere without checking. However I propose that we postpone this until further research gives us the answer. Maybe this car is not a hybrid, I agree, but we need another proof that it is the Hart car.

[Ray B.]

Here is the latest information I found about the story, which means you're right by, as said in this page "the narrowest of margins".
http://www.carkeys.co.uk/features/classichistoric/2938.asp
What makes things more complicated is that many websites draw a parallel between this four-wheel drive car and the Cayenne. And another between the hybrids Lohner-Porsche and the rumor of a hybrid Cayenne (the Cayenne is to me one of the most ridiculous cars of today -although I've seen a Hummer with chrome wheels and low, low profile tires -about as thick as a tortilla to be precise- who beats it).
But a hybrid Cayenne will run second to it.

[Allan L]

Yes, I saw it on all those internet publicity features on the Cayenne and, as is so often the case, the PR people didn't let facts get in the way of a good story.
By combining the fact that Dr. Porsche built a four wheel driven vehicle in 1900 with the fact that he built a petrol-electric car in 1902 they feel that he should have built a 4WD Hybrid, so why not say that he did. Since the Hart vehicle is the only one where photos show all wheels to have hub motors, "let's use its photo - nobody will mind because nobody will know."